carman divorced her because he didnt want to lose the money the girls in the chat room were providing for him.he claims she is crazy and almost let him die.he also claims she would not have sex with him .and when he begged her for it she was no good.
mario divorced her because she was locked into a fantasy about carman and could not get over him until she got him.wonder if she regrets losing mario now?
rose claims carman was impotent and couldnt perform his husbandly duties.
the truth of it all? who knows they all lie so much only the lord knows what is what.
as for what rose looks like ,if you go to totemto temple and email the webmaster he can send you a picture of what rose looks like.
he sent me one and i tell you she looks like a witch.cold evil eyes. he eyes remind me of carmans in fact.
Post Number: 3
Posted From: 188.8.131.52
Posted on Monday, July 25, 2005 - 2:41 am:
hfl and anyone else who feels like she does.
i am a loyal supporter of carman and have been for many many years now and i do not mean the man any harm and would not hurt him for the world. (****) im sure he didnt because i do not belive carman is a thief or a liar.my intention here has been to clarify not slander .
NOTE ***** was a portion left out that lorrie wrote needing clarifying that was answered sufficiently by grace2u and so I wanted to thwart any false rumor because even lorrie claims she would not ever want to do that as a "loyal supporter of carman". I will let others decide for themselves what lorrie's true motives are toward Carman. So far all of lorrie's demonstrations of "concern" for Carman have always seemed to cause more trouble.
And to grace2u, if you still get emailed these posts, I'm sorry for all the editing but I kept trying to prevent another brutal onslaught.
(Message edited by hope_faith_and love on September 09, 2005)
It is better to light a candle than curse the darkness.
Only a man's character is the real criterion of worth. This goes for posters posting here and not just the subject of the postings.
Understanding is a two-way street.
Ahhh! Here is a good one - - What is to give light must endure the burning.
More of Eleanor
Hope, no I gave up the email a long time ago.
Most of us who are trying to get along in spite of our differences are using the system at http://fcnforums.christianity.com/ -- you shouldn't have any trouble locating my user name in the member list.
Just didn't want to leave you out. Feel free to join us . . . it works better than email.</font>
(Message edited by gRACE2U on September 09, 2005)
Do We REALY need to know these details?? & how do you know these things?? Who cares about these things, ...... may i suggest getting on your knees and praying about the victims of katrina than posting about the gossip about carman , is this doing anything positive for the body of Christ?? if God were to respond to this post you have written what do you think his reply would be ??
Thank you ashamed! This website seems to be full of faultfinders and fingerpointers who have nothing better to do...a bunch of baby christians who should be too busy doing the work of the ministry to have so much time to find fault. I have never heard do much ugliness and maliciousness. You could expect that out of the world.
Those are tremendous words, substances and spiritual powers; "Hope Faith and Love", that the Lord gave us to demonstrate and to receive.
Would you point out with the same detail that you have pointed out the faults or vendettas of others, how you minister those three power and life transforming things into the lives or spirits of the posters who visit this site?
You mentioned that you were trying to avoid a "brutal onslaught".
Isn't that what you have done many times on this discussion? It is uncanny in that you shift the emphasis away from your own personal forms of violent reactions and despising of those who you think are out to "destroy", by placing your own characteristics onto those you wish to demise.
I just don't think that any or every rude or blunt person is out to destroy Carman and his ministry. It is his destructive behaviors or those of his employee's that, in my estitmation are being emphasized. One of the most important aspects of relating is listening. Every healthy corporation or business and each healthier so to speak relationship has people in it who listen to concerns or complaints.
When an organization automatically rejects a source or sources for the Holy Spirit or should they demand that this source meet criteria that is not authentically Biblical in some respects, then they are setting up a situation where people are going to feel slighted and insulted and it creates problems. If they were more professional and thanked each person for their input and said it would be committed to prayer, and then did so generally or specifically speaking, I think that Carman would be a better minister with a better ministry and less hostility would exisit against him. When one is not listened to they feel very degraded and wounded.
I have not heard you, and perhaps I am wrong about you, on any occassion mention the person's experience with Carman or Carman's wrong doing.
The posters who come in like the woman above and who shared with some malice herself, who passed judgment and expressed her opinion and ended it with what could be construed a condemning and shame statement, along with the "bunch of baby Christians" crack, is agreed with if she perhaps her brief and somewhat mean comments to those critical of Carman. If someone says the exact same things about Carman i.e., "Carman is acting like a baby Christian, he points the fingers at women and never at himself, his office is full of fault finders who should be demonstrating the attitude and heart of Christ's ministry to all people or the way he is arrogant and volitale is what we could expect from the world"; you would say that it was meant to destroy him or the person was a terrible stalker.
I prayed today, not just judged and I agree that speaking about Carman having an impotence problem is too personal. If he abused Rose and accused her out of the psychology that causes impotence and he would never deal with it other than from perhaps a supposed victim posture, then I think it is possible that God would chasten him by exposure and discussion, while lending grace and understanding at the same time.
If he is abusive,(blasphemy to you I do imagine)and if he would not listen for years to any voice that God sent his way, not just from strangers hearing a Word, but from many people in various levels of interactions with him, about his mother relationship, or anger and other issues, then he might be spanked if you will, or dealt with by something like this.
It doesn't mean that he isn't called, and that he should not be respected for his tenure in ministry or his abilities. He should not be respected for wrongs or secrets.
I am going to pray about removing some of my sentences in kindness and because some things are too personal perhaps. However, it can't be true that every blunt person or every angry person is a dangerous stalker or any of the very malicious names that you yourself have coined against them for merely having an opinion that did not acquiesce to your attachment to him and the meaning you assign to his every attribute.
The woman above mentioned never hearing so much ugliness and maliciousness. To me and I haven't read the great bulk of interactions, it is both parties fighting and striking blows much like leftist democrats and right wing republicans. I personally feel that the behavior in this chat room is very typical. Those who are intolerant of criticism or certain exposures of Carman are the most malicious and ugle and immature in their attacks from what I have seen. I could be wrong, but at the very least I have seen ugliness and malice in those responses.
When someone discusses psychological things, recovery knowledge they are the most attacked. This is disconcerting as we are people of truth and transformation if we are people of the Bible.
It reveals unhealthy spirituality and relating.
Jesus would pray for stalkers and offer them love and comfort to change their hearts and He would listen to their complaints or anger and respond, not necessarily agreeing with them, but understanding with patience and goodness where they preadventure to come from. Only 2% of our human population is criminal or disturbed, Carman and his office have a great responsibility to respect the weak and to be gentle and exhortive. It could be that Carman exalts himself egotistically by utilizing the inappropriateness and rare genuine threat. It is a way of valueing himself at the devalueing of others who Jesus might want him to heal.
If Rose was very hurt by Carman and someone knows her, it could be that they want something to be understood as he seems to have villified her. I don't believe that Carman is perfect, totally innocent and based on what the Lord is saying, he is headed for change. If he is being accused of all manner of things falsely, then he will indeed have a reward as the Bible tells us.
Please don't accuse me of knowing her, I attest to you before the Lord, I do not. I don't know who did what, they both did something very wrong and very strange in my opinion and neither seems to want to truly personally change. What she did to her husband is very questionable according to scripture, however if he was abusive to her and she was damaged she might act irresponsibly or in a distorted and injured way. Everyone seems to villify the other and I haven't read or heard of any repentance or admission as to something being wrong in character, heart or spirit of the accusing person themselves.
It doesn't sound like his office persons give a soft answer for wrath, and that they return disrespect for perceived or literal disrespect.
It also sounds like due to sucess, they don't feel they have the responsibility to be Christian toward each and every person who contacts them. This is not godly and if other ministries employ these insensitivities and tactics, then there needs to be a strong and culture changing addressment of such things within the Body. We are not just to be kind and validating to those who are complimentary or awed by us, touched by us, but to those who are unkind and accusatory, it is the way of Christ.
Lastly, I rethought my decision to read the posts by the woman in Hawaii to understand what you were talking about and I have changed my mind. I don't want to read her or accuse her or exhonerate someone who you are attacking. If I sound like her and that makes you hate me, you must hate her and either way it is not Christian.
I think that for those who look up to Carman realistically or unrealistically, FactNet is a place they should leave and never come back to.
That is what I will do in the near future.
When Patti made the creative comment on the Limbo, that can apply to Carman and his words about women or "wackos" and his statements about how terrible he was treated by Rose. It is the saying we all know, when you point a finger even at finger pointer there are four others pointing right back at you.
I guess for me the conclusion rests in a question. That question is for the Lord, about all of this and the concern for Carman and his current involvement and future ministry.
It would be edifying if I read each person finding a way, going out of their way, to bless and to encourage each other to some degree, no matter what the disagreement or strong feelings may be.
I see people treating each other according to the ways of Carman and his office and the ways of celebrity and arrogance and malice and the carnal self. No matter what your feelings, pro or con about Carman we should be relating to each other in the ways of our Lord.
We are at the first and the last connected to each other in and through Christ, not Carman.
Carman's office staff are having to deal with Christians--- Christians who like yourself, claim to be very mature and knowledgeable but they use intimidation tactics, among others. Then they come here crying that they were not allowed by Carman or his staff to treat them this way? It sounds like Satan trying to defend himself by saying God's been mean to him or Satan coming here and asking if Jesus dying on the cross was love shown to him... or Satan crying out doesn't this seem like "hate"? It's like Satan trying to make us guilty by our overcoming him, by accusing "And you call yourselves a Christian."
And the answer to that is yes. We are like Jesus Christ when we overcome the enemy that tries to destroy the work God is doing, whether it is the work of God within us or the outward work of God we do for Him that is powered by the Holy Spirit to win souls to God.
About the people who come here complaining about how they were treated by Carman's office staff, I was not intending that toward Mercy4.... but that is the reason why I wrote what I did to Mercy4, because I knew that people like Charles would use it and he did.
this is unbeliveable,i cannot comprehend that while there are lost ,homeless, people needing Jesus out there suffering because thier homes , family members, pets and everything, was destroyed & lost because of the hurricane there are people continuing to debate old news about a celeberty!!! im dumbfounded ,, cant you guys let it go even for a moment and stop and pray and help and cry out for the victims of this horrific time?? you come here claiming to be chritians but do this?? i dont understand , i for one wish i could go there help , and pray with , encourage these people, but i cant , but i sure pray and ask the father to help them ect....whatever , im painfuly sad at the so called christins that continue to hash up this crap about stuff that is soooooooooo OLD,UNBELIVEABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have been a Chaplain in the United States Armed Forces for quite sometime and I do possess a level of maturity that is trustworthy. I work fulltime for the Lord and I have incredible accountability in tact in my personal and professional life.
I deal with witchcraft and controlling spirits on a regular basis and I have a large team of ministers outside of my position and in my area who pray for and with me. The comments and challenges I have stated or considered about his office or his life that have been made are truthful and balanced.
I did not "use" anything, she (Mercy)offered it as public and sincere information, it is you who are using it to elevate yourself and your comments to her are in the interest of controlling her emotionally. You are like a cult leader in your motives possible and certainly methods, your own spirit; and that is why you defend Carman or elevate him the way in which a cult member does a leader of such a group.
You demonstrate the dynamics of cult like thinking and cult leader desired attention.
You wish to have power over others through the use of Carman's information and history, positive and negative in garnering for yourself positive attention by "defending" a major minister.
You place or project your character defects onto those who have a background in understanding such things, and you loathe "psycho-babble" as you termed it, because it is within that matrix that you and your real premise is easily exposed.
What you said above is confusing and twisted emotionally as well as spiritually.
"About the people who come here complaining about Carman's office and the way they were treated", you said, in a 'controlling and pejorative, rejecting tone',(very typical dynamics of a cult leader type) is your way of doing what may I inquire?
Denying that his office has ever been unprofessional or abusive? Because holiness in your religion is Carman and all things pertaining to him? If Carman were to pass away or take three years off due to an illness, would the Gospel go forward?
Its "powerful", to you, meaning you are trying to be so, within the arena of speaking to Christians; to use phrases and ideas that are dear to us, such as "winning souls", and "we like Jesus Christ overcome", or this one: "asking if Jesus dying on the cross was love shown to him". All catch phrases and statements that move our hearts to the majesty and wonder and unmatchable value of the realities of Christ. This is very wrong, very wrong spiritually. You feel demonic to me, empowered, provoked, something regardless of the use of the history, doctrines and references to the power of God and the strength of Christ Jesus.
How dare you use the cross and the Name of the Lord in such a selfish and self serving as well as manipulative manner? Carman does not need you to defend him, you are only doing it for attention and control. You throw satan's name and God's name around as though you own the copyright and the intellectual property rights to them to apply at will. You must be familiar with the Ten Commandments and the Lord's serious stipulation against using His precious and saving Name in or for vain purposes.
I have read other earlier posts and only a select few, but I tell you very firmly, I believe that you are a dangerous person and that you are doing something very wrong spiritually on this discussion board. You are as you said to me, "hiding something about yourself by focusing on Carman". That is exactly what you are doing.
<u>How many souls have you personally led to Christ?</u>
I demand in love, and in the discipline of the Lord, that you answer that question before all of the Christians here.
<u>How many people have you discipled over time that are currently serving the Lord sucessfully,
and are placed in positions of responsibility?</u>
Would you please provide us with the name of your pastor and your affiliation?
If you are unwilling to do so, you are demonstrating that you are a wolf in sheep's clothing. If you are legitimate then prove so. You are not a celebrity and so you have nothing to fear from normal accountability.
If anyone takes the time to read the information as it is clearly presented here on this discussion board in other threads and the published information on the Home Page for FactNet you will discover the very patterns of rejection, intolerance, shame and insults and using spiritual terms and ideas to draw people into one's self.
I urge any of the posters who have a sincere heart to follow, hear and obey the Lord to refuse to relate to this person who uses even the power based terms of Hope Faith and Love to represent herself and to control using the "righteousness" of Carman and his evangelistic ministry.
I did not have a bad experience with Carman's ministry office, when I emailed them recently, but I do believe its possible and I don't dismiss what others have shared. I may not agree with the tone or the entire attitude of those that I have read, but I do not dismiss the sharing of hurtful experiences, based on that criteria alone.
It is a trick to use the doctrines, the ministries, the ideas and words of God and the name or body of work of an ordained minister, to control others and gain a sense of power, rage,
and a feeling of prestige. This is molesting and it is violent psychology and pathology.
H has the strongest reactions to psychology and to anything that exposes sexualized behavior or what tears at the fabric of her idealization "for power" of Carman. Her behavior is spiritualized sexual predatorializing; hidden in the encasement of Christ and Christian thoughts and ideas. Her levels of anger and attack and that includes the way she will shoot in, and post and then when she has the feeling of satisfaction or connecting her anger, she will take it off to avoid anything that ruins the rush of anger and connection. She attacks and projects if you wil the things that best expose and define her energy and pathologies.
What bothers her the most, is what is most likely true of her. However, it is not a personal debate alone, there is something truly dangerous about her and that is why she alludes to dangerous behaviors in others based on her opinion or what she has heard from Carman ministries apparently.
I urge every Christian to prayerfully consider avoiding her no matter how spiritual she may "sound" or how "righteous" her stands may seem.
<font face="arial,helvetica"><font color="0000ff">"Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
You will know them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles? So, every sound tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears evil fruit.
A sound tree cannot bear evil fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus you will know them by their fruits.
"Not every one who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father Who is in heaven.""</font></font>
This is exactly why she most likely cites some of the specific terms that she does.
(i.e. bear fruit, will of God, and so on)
It is either psychological or supernatural.
What is she ravenous for?
Its not old news in total. There are new things being discussed. I personally do not appreciate you castigating and shaming, using Katrina and those things we all care about as ammo to come into this place and exert a spiritual stance of correction and abasement.
If you want to focus on Katrina with the majority of your time and spiritual focus that may be what God has called you to in this moment. I have given financially already to the situation and have contributed in other ways as well.
Have you opened your home to a displaced family?
Have you gone to an agency and packed boxes of supplies for the victims?
I appreciate your zeal and compassion for Katrina's ongoing impact on the lives of so many, but I do not appreciate your use of it to condemn others. You are not demonstrating compassion towards those who are involved in a fairly serious debate and you are belittling.
For those who are questioning if God is involved the storm, one group of scriptures that is interesting is: Hebrews 10:26-31.
charles, im not belittleing anyone Im tryingto get you and others to get the focuse OFF carman & his so called problems (wich by the way are none of ANYONES buisness) and on somthing the body of christ needs to be focused on , tell me WHAT WOULD JESUS DO , come here and dicuss carman and gossip and air his dirty laundry or would he be praying or doing whatever he could for the victims of katrina??? i bet on the latter part!!............................................ ................."""Have you opened your home to a displaced family?
Have you gone to an agency and packed boxes of supplies for the victims?"""........ I wish i could do those things , but i cannot , ive sent what i could in moneys, and pray , & pray & pray some more , & im NOT using it to condem others just telling you what needs to be done instead of so called """ debating"" about carman , who the heck cares about carmans past its been delt with over and over & over & over& over again, some people need to quit rolling around the dirty laundry pile and throw it in the washer and let the machine(God) get it clean !!!!!!!!!!!
Lorrie, How do I get in touch with the web master this is all new to me. Oh, wasn't Rose wealthy? I would think that being married to Mario, she would have money. How do you find out all your information? Especially such personal information. Does Carman's mom Nancy work for him? Or is she just at his office? When Carman does his chats, where is he at? In his office or what? Sorry for all the questions, I'm just curious.}
HFL, I have to say you are an angry wind bag. To me it looks like you think if you talk about Jesus and God the Father then you are actually talking for Jesus and God the Father. You donít think anybody is really speaking for God except you and to me it looks like you are the one person who isnít. Just because you are in a garage doesnít mean you are a car.
Mal Vincent preaches a real good sermon on strongholds and how they interfere with us as Christians. In the top three strongholds he talks about one as ďcelebrityĒ. I think thatís where Carman has antagonistic or controlling reactions to the prophetic.