Is anyone here?

[stage director]

I'm not posting anything that has any value to anyone.

Hon, just beng a supportive presence as opposed to part of the problem is of value. Don't underestimate it. Besides, you are very skilled at something I very much value ... presenting the possible obstacles to a person's theology. I think that's not always appreciated.

You don't always know who you influence, Oneway. Case in point, our exchange about the six thousand years vs millions caused me to conclude that maybe the answer isn't as cut and dried as I had thought.

[stage director]

There is not a person here whom God has rejected. His vested interest in each and every one of us is as large as infinity. The difference between his love and ours for our fellow sojourners on this earth is that he knows our history. He was there when it happened, and he can see all the secret hurts and baggage and corrupting influences. How we got to where we're at.

Luk 15:3-4
3 And he spake this parable unto them, saying,
4 What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he lose one of them, doth not leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it?

God cannot rest while even one sheep is lost from him.

[turtle]

There is not a person here whom God has rejected. His vested interest in each and every one of us is as large as infinity. The difference between his love and ours for our fellow sojourners on this earth is that he knows our history. He was there when it happened, and he can see all the secret hurts and baggage and corrupting influences. How we got to where we're at.

Luk 15:3-4
3 And he spake this parable unto them, saying,
4 What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he lose one of them, doth not leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it?

God cannot rest while even one sheep is lost from him.

Amen, and sometime we are just that misplaced or lost for a time from the fold, but God did not stop loving us. His love for us is infinite.

[herbie]

turtle, my issues are not really with posters at Factnet so much, it's on other forums that I'm a member of. These forums that I'm talking about, these are Christian forums. But it seems they have nothing in common with me even tho I feel I have something in common with them.

I'm not seeking anyone to always agree with me or to even agree with me at all. I'm just curious as to whether it even meant anything one way or the other. I'm not exactly stupid, but usually when everyone's thoughts in a long thread are addressed but mine, it doesn't take much to figure out why...I'm not posting anything that has any value to anyone. Keep in mind, I'm not specifically talking about Factnet here. This mostly occurs in other Christian specific forums.

I just see things differently than most. For instance, in another forum, there's a long thread concerning free will versus predestination. I patiently read thru the thread, considered everyone's thoughts, and then pretty much decided that by how some were pushing their position of predestination, it was completely taking the heart of God out of Scriptures.

I felt I needed to stress this point. The next thing you know, I noticed my post had been edited and that I had been pm'd by a mod. The mod edited out most of my post because he felt I was getting too personal about the matter. That was far from the truth. I wasn't getting too personal with anyone. It was their view and how they presented their position, this is what I took issue with.

Some of these posters went as far as claiming no sinner can come to Christ on his/her own because no sinner would know to come to Christ. The part they failed to mention, when a sinner comes to Christ, it is the Holy Spirit that draws him/her. But their logic is backwards. They then use 1 Corinthians 2:14 to support their postion that no sinner can come to Christ because no sinner would understand the things of the Spirit of God.

There is no doubt that 1 Corinthians 2:14 is in direct reference to a born again believer. But the point is, no one was actually born a born again believer, right? We're all sinners before we came to Christ, and we're still all sinners after we have accepted Christ. You'd be suprised by how many professed Christians actually believe they are living a sinnless life. They tend to believe that they have become sinnless on their own, never giving credit where credit is due, and that is to the Holy Spirit for the work He is doing on the inside, and to the finished works of Christ that were accomplished at the cross.

Perhaps a lot of my problem is also in my writing style. It may take me 10,000 words to adequetely explain my thoughts and how I understand things. OTOH, someone with good writing skills can express those same thoughts in 2 or 3 sentences, and do it quite well.

You asked my why I felt God has rejected me. If I feel that I understand something, then I put forth those thoughts in words, yet no one bothers to comment even tho they're commenting on what other posters post, then I'm only fooling myself. I understand nothing of God or His written Word, or about His heart, otherwise it would mean something to someone somewhere some time.

The truth is, I'm torn between whether to feel sorry for myself versus God pretty much rejecting me.

Wow! I hope you don't let a forum make you feel that way.

You know people have opinions of their own, sometimes it takes a while.
All I can think of about the Mod action is, maybe the post was to personal by using the name of the person and not just a reply to the post.

You know this internet is a waste of time. =)

The Chapel preaches both predestination and free will, God will call whomever he pleases.

[dobman53]

Turtle: I made mention of the pyramids, and Nimrods Tower of Bable and all the races coming into exsistance along with their varied religeons!! All this taking place within 500 years as the by products of Noah's 3 son's.

My reason for stating such was my vested interest in pointing out the foolishness of all this happening in such a short time.

In knowing my take on these vested interests of where the 6th day man was how all was possible.

Your responce??? Dob the pyramids happened after Noah's flood. Geesh??? Thats just my point tell me sweet turtle how all as I've spoken of came to be??? in a mere 500 years.

Oneway: Dear friend your old buddy Dob never has wishes for you to be in such a state. Listen to me Dear friend I never fear to tell someone whom I care for that I love them. If it needs repeating so be it Oneway in my heart I do love you. I'm not just saying that to inessance grab the higher ground, I would'nt say it otherwise, period!!!

Now by me saying as such this does not mean that Ya!! go ahead and make me out as the one with little knowledge. I don't say what I do in order to win any popularity contests, certainly not on these threads for thoughs who believe as I are hated with a passion like no others. Think about that for a moment??? You along with a list of others will go so far as team up with athiests in order to see my destruction.

Then thoughs as SD who have devoted their entire lives to see such come to be. People of that type will go so far as dream up make believe lies, and then swear to God it's the holy truth. SD don't get your dandriff all in a tizzy, cause you know I still care for you as well.

Turtle, Truth Child, Night light, Dodge, FOAK, blue water, the list goes on and on. All joining together for one single cause. The elimination of all truth. Then and only then can those in opposition rally together in a united effort. Though seperated they fight like cats and dogs.

But just wait right there for a second!! Think about such a union as what I've just mentioned?? What in the world could draw such a group together as that?? God?? I don't think so!! One as yourself would'nt have to ponder such thoughts very long before you could come up with the alternative answer.

Oneway I've stated this 500 times from the past!! I fought such things that I now know as truth for several years, as I could'nt bear the thought of being out done by anyone or anything!! As I Dob new better than anybody, and I wasn't about to be showed up no matter what the costs. You know my personality Oneway, and you sure enough know when I speak as I'm now doing you see the truth for what ever it's worth.

Here again there's never the need to be in anguish over all these things that can run through a persons mind. God loves us all, and any said anguish was never in his plans, No never!!!

Like Job!! He had to learn his hardships were all Satans doings, never should he have ever allowed others to believe as his friends did. When Job came to the realization of such things instantly God showered him in comforts. Were no different Oneway, as we to should realize the same is in store for us, though for now we to must realize Satan is the culperate of our sorrows.

As we each come to know more and more of Gods will. More and more of our worries will disappear as well. No longer can any decieve us, as with coming to know the truth all unanswered questions seem to fade with still further knowledge.

Join me my friend, you need not to toss everything you've ever known to the road side all at once. No never would one ask such a thing. But to continue as I once did thinking I was to big for my own britches, I soon did find poor old Dob didn't know a fraction of what I once dreamed. I was a little belittled at first but as knowledge grew the wisdom was far better than make believe dreams. I'll never look back and wonder well what if this or what if that?? NOPE the thoughts never cross my mind as I'm free from such confusion all things now finally add up, and what they equal to is truth.

Which ever way you choose
I'll still concider you as a
friend though sometimes
I may not sound like it.

DOB!

[turtle]

Turtle: I made mention of the pyramids, and Nimrods Tower of Bable and all the races coming into exsistance along with their varied religeons!! All this taking place within 500 years as the by products of Noah's 3 son's.

My reason for stating such was my vested interest in pointing out the foolishness of all this happening in such a short time.

In knowing my take on these vested interests of where the 6th day man was how all was possible.

Your responce??? Dob the pyramids happened after Noah's flood. Geesh??? Thats just my point tell me sweet turtle how all as I've spoken of came to be??? in a mere 500 years.

Oneway: Dear friend your old buddy Dob never has wishes for you to be in such a state. Listen to me Dear friend I never fear to tell someone whom I care for that I love them. If it needs repeating so be it Oneway in my heart I do love you. I'm not just saying that to inessance grab the higher ground, I would'nt say it otherwise, period!!!

Now by me saying as such this does not mean that Ya!! go ahead and make me out as the one with little knowledge. I don't say what I do in order to win any popularity contests, certainly not on these threads for thoughs who believe as I are hated with a passion like no others. Think about that for a moment??? You along with a list of others will go so far as team up with athiests in order to see my destruction.

Then thoughs as SD who have devoted their entire lives to see such come to be. People of that type will go so far as dream up make believe lies, and then swear to God it's the holy truth. SD don't get your dandriff all in a tizzy, cause you know I still care for you as well.

Turtle, Truth Child, Night light, Dodge, FOAK, blue water, the list goes on and on. All joining together for one single cause. The elimination of all truth. Then and only then can those in opposition rally together in a united effort. Though seperated they fight like cats and dogs.

But just wait right there for a second!! Think about such a union as what I've just mentioned?? What in the world could draw such a group together as that?? God?? I don't think so!! One as yourself would'nt have to ponder such thoughts very long before you could come up with the alternative answer.

Oneway I've stated this 500 times from the past!! I fought such things that I now know as truth for several years, as I could'nt bear the thought of being out done by anyone or anything!! As I Dob new better than anybody, and I wasn't about to be showed up no matter what the costs. You know my personality Oneway, and you sure enough know when I speak as I'm now doing you see the truth for what ever it's worth.

Here again there's never the need to be in anguish over all these things that can run through a persons mind. God loves us all, and any said anguish was never in his plans, No never!!!

Like Job!! He had to learn his hardships were all Satans doings, never should he have ever allowed others to believe as his friends did. When Job came to the realization of such things instantly God showered him in comforts. Were no different Oneway, as we to should realize the same is in store for us, though for now we to must realize Satan is the culperate of our sorrows.

As we each come to know more and more of Gods will. More and more of our worries will disappear as well. No longer can any decieve us, as with coming to know the truth all unanswered questions seem to fade with still further knowledge.

Join me my friend, you need not to toss everything you've ever known to the road side all at once. No never would one ask such a thing. But to continue as I once did thinking I was to big for my own britches, I soon did find poor old Dob didn't know a fraction of what I once dreamed. I was a little belittled at first but as knowledge grew the wisdom was far better than make believe dreams. I'll never look back and wonder well what if this or what if that?? NOPE the thoughts never cross my mind as I'm free from such confusion all things now finally add up, and what they equal to is truth.

Which ever way you choose
I'll still concider you as a
friend though sometimes
I may not sound like it.

DOB!

I expect nothing but miracles, Okay I know pyramids were not built in a day but they can sure be destroyed in a day. They are after all like any structure. Yet I have to wonder what block would I have to chisel out to make one fall. I mean seriously, which block.

[oneway]

certainly not on these threads for thoughs who believe as I are hated
with a passion like no others

dobman53, I truly hope this is not so. Since I can't speak for everybody, I can't say that it is or isn't true. But speaking for myself, I don't share all of the beliefs you do, but I surely do not hate you, nor do I hate anyone that believes as you.

As humans, we tend to demonize things we don't understand.
The truth is, if I do make it into the kingdom of heaven, even tho you weren't here at the time, I owe you Scers for bringing me out of the backslidden state I was in prior to joining Factnet.

dobman53, even tho your spelling is amiss at times, you are quite witty, and very humorous. These are good traits to possess, especially when the person that possesses these traits uses them properly, such as you do most of the time. I have to say most of the times, and not all the time, because some times you go overboard with your wittyness(I have no clue if that's even a word or if it's spelled right), and sound more offensive than witty. I'm guilty of this myself. I tend to go overboard about a lot of things also.

But one thing I've learned from all of this, I truly have some friends here, irregardless if we all don't share the same beliefs. Loving one another and being there for one another, that's what it's all about. That's what matters most to me, and I'm certain that's what matters most to Him.

I just want all of you to know, especially those of you that went out of your ways to give me assurance that all I do is not in vain, I love you. Love, that's what it's all about. These are the kinds of hearts that the Lord is searching for...those that can love Him, and those that can love others. Afterall, the Lord made us in His image and after His likeness. It doesn't get any better than that.

dobman53, I believe that the Lord did this on day 6, and that that man He created was Adam.
Unfortunately your day 8 man wasn't created in the image and likeness of God, because you say that man was created on day 6. Still I have to wonder how Christ could have come thru this 8th day man, even tho this 8th day man wasn't created in God's image nor after God's likeness? Not trying to argue with you. Just something to seriously think about. I'm sure you've pondered this before. Perhaps you need to ponder it some more.

[dobman53]

Oneway: the 8th day man Adam was made in Gods image. As God said he did realize he had not yet made a man to till the soil. As all men from before had dominion over many different things Yet none to till the soil.

There is a point that I often ponder though it's not mentioned in the Bible. Now this point has no dealings with salvation or any such thing, but my point does relate back to the Egyptians. This point of contintion is of concerns about Tilling the soil where it might have been through Adams seed where the advanced knowledge of such principles might have originated. To then be taken further in advancement by the Egyptians where men were then able to have more time to spend building such things as pyramids.

Here again such things as these are not in themselves any things in concern of Biblical salvation but simply points in time that do follow a correct time line.

Oneway I've been harping on the time between Noah's sons, and the building of the pyramids along with a host of other things happening in that 500 year time line. Now I know your not going to be in agreement with me, but such things as these in my mind lend themselves to further prove the reality of there being the 6th day creation of men aside from that of Adam.

I'm not here trying to put you on the spot, but how is it that you rationalize these things in your mind in regaurds to this 500 year time line?

Dob!

[dobman53]

Turtle: Once again where I asked of you pretty much the same question as I now have with Oneway, how on earth did you come up with knowing the pyramids were not built in one day to chiseling one stone to make them fall in one day???

It seems when your possed a question you don't wish to even think about you start in with your code talking??? Or just exactly what are you talking about, as I haven't the foggiest idea of what exactly your trying to say???

If it's simply that you wish to avoid any such talk?? Or if your not wanting to so much as think about what might be the results from exploring this topic just say so. You have every right in the world to stay within the realms of your own devises. It's your choise to then choose freely.

Dob!

[dobman53]

Arron: If you choose to add something!! Please spare us from telling us all once more how you hate P/M and you are saved. You've once again plastered that all over every thread on Fact-net.

Trust us Arron we know exactly how you feel on that subject, but if you insist I guess you do have the right to tell us all once again, as I'm sure you'll soon enough be telling us all once again of being washed in the blood of Christ, filled with the utterance of Gods one and only holy language. Ect. Ect. Ect.

Arron none of us dought that God loves you. We know you love God in return, but do you forever have to remind us of something we all agree about. Saying it over and over does not make you the better man than any of us, and if you think that some how such talk is instructing us to follow the correct path we've long since passed that point in all of our own personal studies. Such points as those that you constantly bring up, we all learned thoughs things a long long time ago. Trust us Arron were not trying to pull the wool over your eye's we all know about thoughs things, seriously.

Dob!

[michael_ismyfirstname]

Oneway: I wanted to tell you this earlier. My heart goes out to you, I love you. If you were here I would give you a big hug.

I am not going to get tough on you, especially because I have been in a similar emotional state before. It is a dreadful and horrible nightmare. Like some kind of cloud it moves upon me. I am so glad that it does not last.

Just last Wensday I was so down an out that I wanted to evaporate. You know what I did... I went and bought some food because food makes me happy, and I went for a walk. There are many obstacles in life and I don't want to come to a stalemate (as like in a game of chess). I also don't want to sit down and give up.

You are loved and accepted... that is a blessing from the Heavenly Father. His love encompasses us. Go get you some hugs from some loving people. Or go give some hugs to people that are down and out and in need of some love.

What you are facing is not specific to only you. Intellectuals have been prone to be at higher risk of struggling with depression. Also if you are not living in the areas affected by these hurricanes then you are blessed again.

[turtle]

Turtle: Once again where I asked of you pretty much the same question as I now have with Oneway, how on earth did you come up with knowing the pyramids were not built in one day to chiseling one stone to make them fall in one day???

It seems when your possed a question you don't wish to even think about you start in with your code talking??? Or just exactly what are you talking about, as I haven't the foggiest idea of what exactly your trying to say???

If it's simply that you wish to avoid any such talk?? Or if your not wanting to so much as think about what might be the results from exploring this topic just say so. You have every right in the world to stay within the realms of your own devises. It's your choise to then choose freely.

Dob!

I use to have a puzzle called a pryamid much like the rubiks cube, but you seldom see even the rubik anymore being sold in stores. Kids are to much in to things that beep and make noise on a screen to try and twist a toy. Now dob you ask me to speak english about pryamids and so I will tell you this, pryamids were made of brick made of straw and mud. Straw is burnable, but in brick form it is not so I got to find another way for it to fall once you don't want to. See pyramids are on a solid foundation in appearance. Built so the structure goes inward and smaller at the top. Not a very destructable force unless you find the weak link. BTW you talk more code then a barrel of monkees. oh did you know egyptian cats were even burried in those egyptian tombs. Tall slinky cats, I have known a few. Always a part of every good egyptian tale even if they don't have a main role. Reason I do not like pryamids or at least some of them they use to burry the family in them, after the king died. All the kings people drank arsenic inside.

[truth_child]

to the one who said i hated pm or murray i do not hate any one so dont accuse me of doing so no... i do not agree with the and yes i hate the lies they are tell but i do not hate any person

[jargon631]

Truth child if you can not see the fruit for what it is then there is NOWAY I can dictate to you. You do not want to go beyond what you have been spoon fed at your church. Let me say there are many kenites among us and we can no them by their traits. People like Adam Sandler, Ben Stiler and many other comics who are so sac religious and continue to push the envelopes look like good candidates to me. Many hollywood types are people our children look up too are also I believe Kenites. Stop going to their movies and giving them your money! http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm...ndid=236481776

so is a kenite anyone who disagrees with your bizarre outlook on life?...we havent posted to one another, but having read your posts i would have to say that we probobaly disagree on just about everything...if u tell me the sky is blue im going to run outside and see for myself...does that make me a kenite...hmmm...fd...

[jargon631]

Satan came disguised as a FULL GROWN man, an evil spirit who conceived with eve an evil nation of people from the line of cain!

you always give me something to laugh about though...fd...

[jargon631]

maybe im a g.i. joeite...fd

[turtle]

maybe im a g.i. joeite...fd

Then were is barbie. Do you know the history of the barbie doll, if Christians did they never let their kids play with them. I was utterly shocked. They use to have them in bars. The orignial ones, I forgotten alot of the history, after knowing it I felt it was unimportant to retain because I don't have any kids

[oneway]

I'm not here trying to put you on the spot, but how is it that you rationalize these things in your mind in regaurds to this 500
year time line?

dobman53, the first thing we have to rationalize, is this 500 year timeline accurate? The Bible is written in such a way that it would be difficult for the common reader to come to a perfect conclusion concerning timelines.

For example, Gen 10 is written in an outline so to speak. We simply find other places in Scripture to fill in the missing details. For example, when we read Gen ch 11, we know that this occured within the outline presented in Gen ch 10. IOW, all of the things in Gen 10 didn't all occur first, then what is written in Gen 11 occured afterwards. If we read it in this manner, we'll be way off.

Now getting back to your question. Let's say for the sake of argument that this 500 year timeline is accurate, and that the whole world was procreated from these 3 familes.

Let's assume after they got off the ark, they each got their wives pregnant. Unless things were different back then, it usually takes 9 months for a female to have a child. Then we have to consider twins, trplets, etc. Then we have to consider another 14-20 yrs for the children to grow up in order that they can produce children. So the question is, how many people could be calculated to have been born and living on the earth in a span of 500 yrs, with 3 families as the starting point?
To be honest, I have no idea. Do you? If so, what would you calculate as the numbers? We also have to keep in mind that people would also be dying during this 500 years. And we also have to keep in mind, do we know how many people were actually alive on the earth after 500 yrs had elapsed since departing the ark and would a calculation based on 3 families jive with the results, assuming we know approx how many people were living after 500 yrs?

[oneway]

I use to have a puzzle called a pryamid much like the rubiks cube, but you seldom see even the rubik anymore being sold in stores. Kids are to much in to things that beep and make noise on a screen to try and twist a toy. Now dob you ask me to speak english about pryamids and so I will tell you this, pryamids were made of brick made of straw and mud. Straw is burnable, but in brick form it is not so I got to find another way for it to fall once you don't want to. See pyramids are on a solid foundation in appearance. Built so the structure goes inward and smaller at the top. Not a very destructable force unless you find the weak link. BTW you talk more code then a barrel of monkees. oh did you know egyptian cats were even burried in those egyptian tombs. Tall slinky cats, I have known a few. Always a part of every good egyptian tale even if they don't have a main role. Reason I do not like pryamids or at least some of them they use to burry the family in them, after the king died. All the kings people drank arsenic inside.

Hi turtle. I'm not sure if you ever did drugs, if not you might not be familiar with this magazine that I saw this article in back in the 70's. Anyway, back then I used to do drugs. I would also buy a magazine called "High Times". It was perfect for pot heads such as I. I recall reading an article in there about pyramids. They showed you how you could build your own pyramid scaled down to whatever size that you wanted. You could even make it out of cardboard if you wanted a small coffee table sized one. According to this article, these pyramids were built with a perfect relation to the distance of earth to the sun in mind. This is where the ideas came from that ETs built these. According to this article, if one were to build a perfectly scaled replica, then have one of it's sides pointing in the exact proper direction, then one could put some pot inside of it, leave it there overnight, and the next day the pot would be more potent than what it was before putting inside the pyramid. Also, you could put a dull razor in there, and the next day it would be razor sharp. Apparently pyramids possess some types of mythical powers according to High Times. Keep in mind whom this mag was written for. It was written for all the stoners, lol. Apparently all of us stoners believed anything this mag wrote, lol.

[michael_ismyfirstname]

If I wasn't so busy I would spend some time researching what you posted about oneway The 500 years... not about drugs and pyramids, lol. I believe the theme behind the flood is, do not follow a multitude of people to do evil. At the tower of babble the Creator could of had the insight that they would again be a multitude of people following after evil. So he split them into factions. Rather than waiting for them to become completely corrupt; to ensue his wrath succeeded by Judgment.

The language barriers probably remain so that humanity doesn't become one entity to be easily swayed towards evil.

Maybe humanity as split into factions is better at not becoming a multitude of people doing only evil; there by postponing a Judgment.