Black Metal Music

[easeltine]

Just defining exactly what we are talking about regarding this subject:

Peter Tagtgren

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Tagtgren

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1123499/bio

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Peter-...264868?sk=info

Types of Music: Industrial Metal, Death Metal, Black Metal

“Death Metal - The lyrical themes of death metal may invoke slasher film-stylized violence, but may also extend to topics like satanism, anti-religion, occultism, Nature, mysticism, philosophy, Science Fiction, and politics. Although violence may be explored in various other genres as well, death metal may elaborate on the details of extreme acts, including mutilation, dissection, torture, rape and necrophilia.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_metal

“Black Metal - Black metal has often been met with hostility from mainstream culture, mainly due to the misanthropic and anti-Christian standpoint of many artists. Moreover, several of the genre's pioneers have been linked with church burnings and murder.”

“…some have been linked to neo-Nazism”

“Black metal was originally used as a term for extreme metal bands with Satanic lyrics; today, the most common and founding lyrical theme is opposition to Christianity and other organized religions. As part of this, many artists write lyrics that could be seen to promote atheism, antitheism, paganism or Satanism.”

“…which have featured impaled animal heads, mock crucifixions, medieval weaponry, and band members doused in animal blood.”

“…inverted crosses/pentagrams to reinforce their anti-Christian or anti-religious stance.”

“…anti-Christian and Satanic themes”

“Satanism as an ideology defined black metal…”

“Artists who oppose Christianity tend to promote atheism, antitheism, paganism, or Satanism.”

“Black metal was originally used as a term for extreme metal bands with satanic lyrics…”

“National Socialist black metal (NSBM) is a term used for black metal artists who promote National Socialist (Nazi) beliefs through their music and imagery…”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_metal

[dodge]

Easeltine -- You certainly seem obsessed with metal music, and attempting to link it to Satanism, evil, anti-Christian, neo-Nazi sentiments that lead to murder and church burning. I know that the reason you point to Peter Tägtgren right off is because you know he’s one of Sammael and Shadowcat’s favorite artists.

In fact, your post here is an exact copy and paste of the same one you posted on December 22nd in the Exorcism or Deliverance thread you started last October. Sammael responded to it, yet here it is again; your attempt at associating Peter Tägtgren with Satanism, torture and rape, church burnings, and murder.

I would suggest that you’re doing this to harass Sammael and Shadowcat; and also note that in the user’s agreement it says that by becoming a member here you agree “not to post the same message twice on the forums.” Just an observation, Easeltine; and something I think you should be reminded of.

I would also point out that this type of “metal music” isn’t the only art form that contains material you point out and object to. There are movies, books, paintings, and other media that contain Satanic, anti-Christian, and brutal slasher-type subject matter. As far as “neo-Nazi” content, there are a number of “black metal” bands that represent this genre; not to mention “Nazi punk” music that had lyrics expressing hatred for Jews and homosexuals. There was even a “Nazi chic” style that started in the mid-seventies with the Sex Pistols using Swastikas as part of clothing design. However, as Sammael and Shadowcat told you, they don’t listen to these groups.

I don’t care for black/thrash/death metal music either; but we discussed all of this already, and I feel there isn’t anything more to say about it…yet you started a thread with that very topic.

[shadowcat]

This entire thread should be deleted. He is clearly trying to provoke and harrass, just as he did in the Exorcism and Deliverance thread and just as he has done on every other thread.

I think it might be time for me to just take a very very long break from fn. There is clearly a lot of issues that some people have here with others and they just can't seem to stop it seems.

I had complained to Josh about this in a previous private message awhile back and nothing really was done or said until yesterday when I brought it up again. The excuse of me having to hunt the posts down is not really valid because the posts are right there before some of sam's responses that were deleted for flaming. The posts were ignored by the moderator yet the responses get deleted, sam gets warned, then eventually banned. Also when an entire thread is nothing but based on flaming and accusatory posts such as the deliverance thread is, what am I suppose to go copy and paste an entire thread and put it in a private message?

And now this thread, which has been created for the same purpose. Yet I was told that easeltine would be warned to back off of this accusatory flaming behavior.

But there is no bias here right?

[dodge]

See renowned Swedish death metal producer Peter Tägtgren do a Listerine commercial.

[easeltine]

http://www.spirit-of-metal.com/album...atan-l-en.html

1. An Apprentice of Satan.
2. The Trial.
3. Dead Skin Mask.
4. Remember the Fallen.
5. Pagan Fears.

[dodge]

[easeltine]

The title of the album song recorded by Peter Tägtgren is:

"Teach Children to Worship Satan"

As an Atheist you cannot believe that this is an acceptable thing to do?

[dodge]

Easeltine, the album “Teach Children to Worship Satan” is by Dark Funeral, a Swedish black metal band. Peter Tägtgren was the engineer and producer, not a member of the band. The album was recorded more than twenty years ago.

I think they would get off on your reaction, because they rattled your conservative Christian cage…just like what you do with your extreme right-wing rhetoric aimed at liberals. It’s only music, an expression of youthful disenfranchisement and rebellion against the status quo. Nobody’s out there offering human sacrifices to Satan. It’s a meme and a metaphor, a message to you and society in general. Do you get just as self-righteously indignant about the popularity of brain-eating Zombies and blood-sucking Vampires?

Lighten up about black metal music, Easeltine. It doesn’t mean what you think it does. As Shadowcat and Sammael told you many times…don’t criticize what you don’t understand.

[easeltine]

"...what you don’t understand."

You have that right. I will never understand how it is acceptable for a Black Music Band to sing, "Teach Children to Worship Satan."

I also will never understand how an Atheist that believes in the ideals of Secular Humanism could defend any band that says to, "Teach Children to Worship Satan."

Nope! You are right, I will never understand that.

There are people in this world that hurt other people, and Satanism practices hurting other people.

[chad14]

athesist cna teach NOTHING they are unbeleivers

[dodge]

Hi Easeltine. You wrote that “Satanism practices hurting other people.” Could you give me an example of this? What particular “Satanist” group are you thinking of, and how are they hurting people?

[easeltine]

"Moreover, several of the genre's pioneers have been linked with church burnings and murder. For these reasons and others, black metal is usually seen as an underground form of music. Additionally some have been linked to neo-Nazism, however most black metal fans and most prominent black metal musicians reject Nazi ideology and oppose its influence on the black metal subculture." Dead's suicide/ Church burnings/ Euronymous's murder/ Conflict between scenes/ Satanism/ National Socialist black metal- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_metal

Dodge, Black Metal Music may contain some of the worst examples of Satanic Ritual Abuse I can find!

[turtle]

Easeltine I think what sad here you only picking on a particular race or do you mean black as evil heavy metal band. See Most heavy metal groups that I heard about growing up. So now you terminology does not compute. Nazism usually means whites as well, but you saying there are black nazi groups. Oh yeah I named one. However that beside the point. I think heavy metal in general seem to bring about certain talk concerning Satan. I would not be surprised if there are not latino and other groups. Satan worshippers are not about race, its acceptance of evil and evil art, and evil practices. Deception to your face. Can be as evil as people walking in sheep clothing. Or worse yet straightly telling you who they are. Yet unless you catch them in a ritual and live to tell it, no one will go to jail.

[dodge]

You’re really grasping at straws, Easeltine. You mentioned “satanic ritual abuse” in relationship to Black Metal Music. By saying that, it tells me that you have no idea what’s meant by “satanic ritual abuse.” It’s true that there have been some “black metal” musicians who were involved in criminal activity (church burnings, murder, etc.); but you can’t use that to define all musicians in the “black metal” genre. There are those who engage in violent criminal behavior in all sections of society. It’s part of who we are as humans. Always has been, always will be. I could point out the Catholic Church as having been a place of ritual child abuse for many decades; but does that incriminate every priest, bishop, and cardinal? You’re focusing on demonizing black metal music. This seems to be what you’re interested in for reasons of your own.

In fact, the article from Wikipedia that you quoted from doesn’t even mention “Satanic ritual abuse.” Where did you pick that up? This started as a panic about a worldwide conspiracy by the wealthy/powerful “elites” who some thought were involved in abducing children for sacrifices, pornography and prostitution. All that has been discredited, with evidence of false memory implanting through “recovered memory therapy.” It turned out to be fantasy, hysteria and mass projection. In addition to “false-memory syndrome” there was involved urban legend-making, and contamination by therapists and the media.

The stories that came out behind this panic were about bizarre satanic activities involving murder, torture, human sacrifice, cannibalism. Most of that came from “adult survivors” who claimed to have experienced this sort of ritual abuse when they were children; and from children who described ritual abuse that was often in the context of day care settings. That these were all false memories, group hysteria, and hoaxes have been demonstrated over time. None of the hundreds of “satanic ritual abuse” allegations that surfaced across the U.S. had ever been substantiated, even after intensive criminal investigation.

There was a study done in the early 90s that found allegations of “satanic ritual abuse” to be without merit. More than twelve thousand accusations were investigated; and more than eleven thousand psychiatric, social service, and law enforcement personal were surveyed. No evidence at all was found that lent support to the conclusion that there had ever been a single case of “satanic ritual abuse.”

See “The Creation of Satanic Ritual Abuse,” by Bette L. Bottoms and Suzanne L. Davis (University of Illinois at Chicago) who explore the sociocultural, individual, and therapy-related factors that may have been responsible for the creation of these ritual abuse allegations; and their work on “Jurors’ Reactions to Satanic Ritual Abuse Allegations.”

http://guilfordjournals.com/doi/abs/...urnalCode=jscp

http://www.uic.edu/labs/pll/bottoms-...rs-satanic.PDF

Your attempt to demonize black metal music with claims of “satanic ritual abuse” is pathetic, though amusing.

[easeltine]

To a Satanist, Satan and Black Magic are real.
To a Christian, Satan and Black Magic are real.
Just about every form of religion understands that Satan and Black Magic are evil.

...But to Dodge Black Magic is simply the words of the following song:

That old black magic has me in its spell, that old black magic that you weave so well.
Those icy fingers up and down my spine
That same old witchcraft when your eyes meet mine.
The same old tingle that I feel inside, and then that elevator starts its ride
And down and down I go, round and round I go, like a leaf that's caught in the tide.
I should stay away, but what can I do?
I hear your name and I'm aflame
Aflame with such a burning desire that only your kiss can put out the fire.
For you're the lover I have waited for, the mate that fate had me created for.
And every time your lips meet mine, darling, down and down I go, round and round I go
In a spin, loving the spin I'm in, under that old black magic called love.

At least the song sounds better than that Black Metal junk!

[dodge]

Black magic? You got to be kidding me, Easeltine. I would say that if there are actually people out there who believe they are “Satanists” who practice “black magic” then they are delusional and their families should seriously consider a mental health crisis intervention. I would put them into the same category as those who think they’re vampires or werewolves…insane. Unless, of course, it’s all part of a pretentious affectation.

There were at one point in history Christians who believed in “black magic,” who were also insane. They murdered people who they thought were “witches” or “wizards” because that’s what their Bible told them to do. “Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live,” “a man also or woman that hath a familiar spirit, or that is a wizard, shall surely be put to death: they shall stone them with stones.” Most of it was caused by a misogynistic fear of women, that resulted in mass hysteria and unspeakable atrocities. If you believe that the Bible is the word of God, and you obey each and every commandment found in it, it would lead to this type of insanity.

If there are those who call themselves Christians who believe in “black magic,” then I would see them as naïve and ignorant; and potentially dangerous if they’re biblical literalists. As far as belief in “Satan” and other such imaginary “supernatural entities” (demons and angels), it’s part of the irrationality of religious mythology. None of it has anything to do with reality, and why people would believe such things is the subject of psychology.

[turtle]

Witch doctor in south america and Africa, and Asia. Is that black magic or divination. Yes people kicked from their tribe die because of being outcast thought they know how to hunt and survive. So now with that said. Think about it, there are groups that uses forms of cursing a person to death, or serious illnesses. Does it have any power against God no. But does man taking a butcher knife to one demostrate a man power to harm someone. Yes. See one might not have the physical strength of David ot slaying 10,000 men at one time with a small army. However with the strength that comes from God the impossible can happen in the case like David.


Your problem dodge you rationalise to much about strength of guns, and knives compared to the hand of God stretching for to deliever. However first you need to grasp that even though you can seem to grasp God, and other people do. That in your world view I am wrong but it does not make my world view right. Rememeber that. From your point I know God is even around you, but guess what you do not know it, for your refuse to know it. That is your choice.

[chad14]

no one can cast a spell on me im saved and protected by GOD (JESUS) PTL

[dodge]

I didn’t say you were wrong, Turtle; I actually never said anything about you personally. Do you believe that there are witches and wizards in the world who can influence people and events through mysterious supernatural forces using Black Magic? Do you believe in vampires, werewolves, and zombies too? What about flying fire-breathing dragons, elves, fairies, gnomes, harpies, squonks, and unicorns? I don’t see any difference between these imaginary beings and angels, demons, Satan and Christ…none of which exist outside of your mind. You’ve obviously been indoctrinated into the irrational world of religious mythology.

[turtle]

No dodge I am survivor , a train wreck, cult survivor and illness survivor when there was no hope but God. I thank and praise the good LOrd. He is awesome God and worthy to be praised His name is Jesus.